Protecting against Toxicity with JEMS

Hello, friends, future friends, haters, and ex lovers. Welcome back to another episode of Crimes of the Heart. I'm your host, Rory Uphold. And before we jump into it, I wanted to say that I'm doing another giveaway. pew, pew, pew! That's right, I'm going to be giving away three 12 packs of gems. Um, okay, so what are gems?

Great question. Well, if you've been listening for a while, you know that I know my way around a toxic man or two. But what I didn't know, and what you also might not know, is that it's not just the people we date who can be toxic. It's also a lot of the wellness products we use. How insane is that? Today's episode is with GEMS, a non toxic condom company.

Because, yeah, you guessed it. A lot of condoms are toxic. This information both stunned and infuriated me, especially since STI rates are literally the highest they've ever been. So anyway, go to the link in the show notes or the link in my Instagram or my TikTok bio and you can go to the website and you can sign up for the mailing list, which as I've said before, I will not spam you. You'll just simply be entered to win a 12 pack of gems. And for any other future giveaways. And because I really only ever want to recommend things that I actually like and believe in and think will add value to your life, in the same way that I only have guests on that I like and believe in.

I mean, you guys don't know this, but I actually killed an episode because... I thought that actually it was toxic and it wasn't in line with the values of this show or of me. And so I refuse to put or endorse anything out there that I don't actually think is going to add value to my listeners lives or be entertaining.

One of the two. So anyway. I say all of this to say that I have actually used gems, and I do actually think that they're great. In fact, I used them with this guy that I've been seeing, and we both agreed that they're probably the thinnest condoms, uh, we've ever used. So, I'm a convert. Plus, they look cute, and really, the most important part is that they're not toxic, which is what this whole episode is going to be about.

And before we meet the creators of Gems, please make sure that you've rated this show five stars and dropped me a review. Just let me know your favorite part about this show or even this episode. Okay, now let's meet Whitney Geller and Yasmin Emery, the founders of Gems. Welcome to Crimes of the Heart.

Thank you. We're so happy to be here.

I'm so, Glad to have you guys look, I am probably way too old to, to have had the realization that I had when your PR team hit me up and I said, condoms are toxic. What the fuck? So let's start there. Well, Pretty much, even more than condoms are toxic. It's more the idea that, you know, we've been putting things in our bodies for however long without any idea of what that was or what was included, which is sort of what started our whole search, was the fact that we didn't know because there was no transparency of the ingredients on the package.

So that was the biggest place where we sort of had that moment of like, what the hell wait. They're not even listed on packaging. No, and Whitney's celiac, so she actually checks everything quite rigorously. And it's, it's, yeah, condoms, tampons, they're not required to list ingredients. And of course no one assumes they have ingredients because of that, but they absolutely do.

And when we started digging into what some of those ingredients are and, and the reactions that they can cause we were pretty shocked. So, you know, again, like Whitney said, that was really what part of. What motivated us to make change in this industry. The other part of around toxicity really stand from this idea of stereotypes, um, you know, gender stereotypes, sexual stereotypes that the.

Brands that are out there and have existed for so long and who have reigned sort of this industry have been perpetuating. So we really wanted to take into account this idea of like a multiplicity of sexualities and gender expressions and how we're not so limited to, I think this very narrow, heteronormative view of sex and broaden it so that we can be much more inclusive and speak to a much wider audience.

Yeah. 

 What are.

Some ingredients. Ingredients, because I, I did do a little bit of research and was like, oh fuck. I feel dumb, but I had no idea. No, absolutely, and we didn't either, honestly, until we started looking into it. So Benza Cain is a common one that is that numbing agent, and it's often advertised as this thing that will help you last longer or deepened pleasure, heightened pleasure.

And it's really something that. A lot of people have reactions to, um, particularly Vulvas can be have, you know, pH balance can get thrown off from Benzocaine. So that's one thing that we took off the table. Uh, spermicide is another thing that can be found in com, uh, uh, found in condoms, uh, flavors, colors, preservatives, all things again that you don't think of, but those are ingredients and people can have reactions to them.

And so we really just wanted to strip it back and use. Only what's essential. So we are gems is natural latex a hundred percent silicone lube, nothing more. What is the difference for somebody that doesn't know me between natural latex and not natural latex? So polyurethane would be the plastic kind of equivalent.

I mean plastic, I guess isn't the right word, but non latex version of condoms. There are those who do have allergies to latex, so that is a NEC necessary alternative. But we just think, you know, natural latex is, a biodegradable ingredient and so it's, from a sustainability perspective, it, it's really sort of what we believe in as being the best ingredient. 

So how did GEMS get started?

Yeah, it's an interesting story. Um, Yasmin and I have been in business together actually for over 10 years. We have a design studio in Toronto, Canada that we do everything from packaging, part of it, branding. Amazing. Um, and we do, you know, everything from tip to tail with big corporations and startups and packaging and lots in lots in this space.

Not with condoms, but in kind of packaging and C P G, and we were between pregnancies. It was just before the pandemic. And I found myself in the condom aisle and staring at, you know, an aisle that looked like nothing had changed since the, we say the 1950s, but really probably before that. Um, and then, Sort of the story we were telling earlier of like picking up the condom package, keep picking up more, condom package, couldn't find any ingredients, a really quick phone call to Yamin.

I was like, oh my gosh. Like have you been in a condom mile recently? Like it's insane. It looks. So dated and there's no ingredients. And she was like, I can't believe that. And when we dug a little bit further, we found out that STIs are at the highest levels in history, the highest they've ever been. You know?

And nobody knows that. And it's predominantly between the ages of 15 to 25. It's predominantly among marginalized groups. It's just crazy. It seemed to us that nobody was talking about it and kind of based on. What we have done for a living. And understanding that design and communications matter, it's, it, it tells you whether a product is for you.

It tells you whether you wanna use a product, whether it feels like it fits into your life. We understood that condoms were not something that was speaking to young people, not something that felt like it should be living on their shelves. And it felt like something that we could tackle because we had this experience in design.

now naively, you know, we're like, oh, it's. This is gonna be easy. No problem. but that was sort of the origin of it. And we ended up at, um, at one of those like massive targets, you know, that's like a city block. And we were standing on a corner between men's skincare on our right, that was like everything from eye bombs and.

You know, just all kinds of face tonics, which is amazing. And you know, representation matters in every industry. But then when we looked at the left and we saw this entire aisle of condoms and it looked exactly like it did, we thought, you know, something's wrong. And we've just accepted that this is the way condoms have been forever.

So messaging like Performax and Trojan, and you know, very focused on male pleasure, very focused on performance, and kind of just these icky. Toxic stereotypes associated with sex and masculinity. It's funny to me that there were like two toxic things that you guys wanted to challenge. Yeah, exactly.

Totally. Like that's why we, we messaging and the branding, but then quite literally, yeah. The ingredients that go, in things that are not healthy for us. Mm-hmm. That's beyond fucked up. So you said something, Whitney, about STDs are at the highest they've ever been. That's nuts. I have not seen that. Yeah, it's, nobody really talks about it.

It's one of those things, you know, condoms had their moment during the AIDS epidemic when really people were associating, I need condoms because I need the protection from aids. 

But what's actually happening right now is there's all kinds of, I mean, syphilis is something that's definitely being spread around, and it's one of those things, if you do catch it, you can be treated for it, but it can also have. No symptoms, and so people won't know they have it and it can be very dangerous.

Um, there's things like antibiotic resistant strains of gonorrhea, so it's not as simple as going to take a pill. It could end up being, um, you know, on iv in hospital. Uh, it's, it's. Was a problem before the pandemic STIs were on this rise. But then what happened during the pandemic was actually all the contract tracers from STI clinics went towards tracing covid.

And so there was this huge gap in, in what was happening in terms of tracking for STIs. And they just kept going up and up and skyrocketing. And as you know, you know, it just, there isn't a lot of messaging around. Prevention of STIs. There isn't a lot of pro-con um, conversation out there, and it certainly is a huge mission for us because again, sort of what we were talking about is there's not this fun association with condoms.

There's this idea that condoms suck, they decrease pleasure, nobody wants to wear them. Well, we really believe that if you can flip that conversation and position condoms is something that actually increases pleasure because it's gonna decrease your anxiety. And sort of increase inhibition, um, that we actually believe it can increase pleasure.

I've shared this on the show before, but the best sex I've ever had was all with guys who wore condoms. Mm-hmm. wrote in a question to, I believe it was Rachel Wolfson who was on the show. She's the she's the first and only woman in the jackass universe.

Amazing comedian. Um, love it. And I was like, I'll take this. Because I think even asking the question, condom no, condom to me is like such a red flag. Like I don't understand why that's even, why are we even thinking that we wouldn't and. I was like, dude, you're putting yourself in a category of guys that like don't fuck as well as other guys that do.

I know we've talked a lot about Gen Z, but I did see a pretty wild. Stat on your website? Oh, yes, yes. And I would, I think people would be shocked to know that the demographic that has had a 240%, I don't even know, I mean like, I can't even fathom that increase in STIs is, would you like to finish that?

Yeah. Our amazing seniors granny's getting it on. Granny's totally getting it on, and they getting, they're rod dogging because they don't have not been in a non-monogamous relationship for years. And so when they're in a position to start dating again, that habit of grabbing a condom just isn't there.

And so STI rates are really high. So yeah, the d i, Whitney, you always know this stuff better, but. There is a disproportionately high percentage of STIs in ages 15 to 24, and then 60 plus. So truly gen, you know, gen Z and the senior demographic are, are who we need to be talking to. And so we sort of are nurturing this conversation between Gen Z and their grandparents and talking about sex and the importance of safer sex.

The boomers be booming. That's wild. Yeah. Wow. Okay. Yeah. Grandma and, and grandkids. Like, let's chop it up. It's exactly, it's, it's literally in retirement home, so there's like massive outbreaks of STIs, which is amazing. Like, it's great to hear, you know, you're, that's mm-hmm. Fabulous. Um, yes, yes. But yeah, they.

They miss sex ed the first time around. It didn't, you know, it didn't really exist, although hard to say that it's really existing right now. But, um, and then they're not worried about pregnancy as something. Um, that's a big thing you hear from that population and you're like, well, it's not, you know, condom use is not about necessarily pregnancy.

There's all these other things, um, they clearly weren't thinking about. ,

 again, we don't, we never wanna come from a place of fear mongering because, That's just not gonna do it. But it's this idea of empowering folks to, consider their safety, their body, um, and make the right choices for themselves.

And condoms are a part of that, and that's really the way in which we wanna talk about it. So that's kind of how we're approaching it. Yeah. Cause I was gonna say the other toxic side of it is like, Oh my God. You have to use a condom because you don't wanna get an STD because it's the worst thing ever because then that makes you dirty or gross or bad.

Totally. That is not helping. Right? Like I have, only in my life I've ever, this might come as a shock to no one. I've had multiple partners, One. One my whole life told me that he had herpes. Right. And I'm like, okay. But the odds are it's like one in every three year, one in every four. Exactly. So I'm like, lemme hear the story.

The math is not math thing. Yeah. And consequently, that one person that told me, I felt very safe with that person because I knew that that person was willing to tell me the truth when it was uncomfortable. Yeah, and would be honest with me in the face of fear or in the face of rejection. And I will say that our relationship, you know, started off very strong.

And, and to this day, I, you know, I'm, I'm still friends with this person. and Contracted tepees. Right. So I, I share that story just to be like, I don't know, it's it, we should be able to have this conversation. And then sometimes, now that I have the show and I talk about it more freely, people feel open sharing that they have an s t i or, or their stories.

And I'm like, yeah, it's really not. We have, we've got to, I love that it's a part of the conversation around gems, because I think on the one hand, yeah, prevention is amazing, and now we're in this new era of like birth control, plan B. Yeah. Of course, portions, IUDs are all kind of up in the air. Mm-hmm. So, There's this added stress and, and pressure.

At least for me, I'm like, oh God, if I was, yeah, 16, 17, even 22 right now, I think I would be terrified having sex. Yeah. And I, you know, you really hit on something with changing the conversation cuz it's the same, the way that mental health feels, especially post pandemic is something that's on everybody's.

Mind and certainly something people are more willing to talk about. It's kind of feels table stakes. Like everybody has mental health issues. We're all talking about them. And I would hope that people's sort of sexual health would follow along those lines too. Like the more we normalize it becoming a part of the vernacular and part of a conversation you have with partners, the more everybody will feel comfortable doing it.

Um, you know, it's, it's interesting also, We would never have worn before. The pandemic, like hand sanitizers and masks is something we talk a lot about right there. There're all kinds of just other barriers, so condoms fit very nicely into that. If you can get away from the stigma that has something to do with your sexual life and you just think of it as another kind of way to take care of yourself, like really a part of.

Wellness as we believe it. Um, then we think there is more of a chance of people carrying them, using them when they need them, not being embarrassed to bring them up in the context with a partner. You know, we love this idea, like you were talking about, the, the condom is the most amazing time to have the, have the moment about consent because.

What else can be such an, you know, an obvious change from one circumstance to another. So, you know, we think that's a really big bonus to it as well. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. And it's weird because I was embarrassed, like when I think back to when I was younger for sure. I remember being like, Ugh, and, and just, I.

Trying to get them or going through the checkout and like, what would that person think? And ultimately, yeah, if I, now I go back and I go, maybe I wasn't really ready. I was in some aspects, but I think feeling uncomfortable. Like why? Why did I feel so uncomfortable and embarrassed? I mean, we've been part of that.

So many reasons. Yeah. I mean, even, you know, we were buying com, we were buying condoms. We had this idea of the competition and going to the pharmacy and you know, and I have three children, like the, the jig is up, but it still felt uncomfortable. And part of that was the packaging and sort of what was being displayed across the cashier's table.

You know, when there's like a half naked torso or a name like Performax, I feel like the person is associating me with something that didn't feel like myself. you know, I think there's. Other things. Uh, there's, you know, there's places in the country where condoms are under lock and key at a gross at a pharmacy, like legitimately lock and key with a red button that you have to push to get somebody to come over and unlock it.

And it's not, obviously because they're the highest ticket price item, it's because they're a high theft item because people are so embarrassed to buy them. Mm-hmm. So for us, it's all part of. De-stigmatizing and really kind of just normalizing the use of condoms that we think could change this whole sort of vicious circle about that.

Absolutely. And I think, I mean, you touched on sort of reproductive rights. We also talk a lot about sex education or lack thereof, and this idea that if these conversations aren't being had from a very young age, and I have a five year old and we talk about consent and obviously I. It's different than sexual consent, but it's consent with your body.

And so if these conversations aren't being had at a very young age, it's not gonna feel normal when you hit your sexual kind of coming of age moment and you, like you said, are you ready? Are you not? Do you know enough? Have you had these conversations? These are all feelings. You're feeling alone because you haven't had the opportunity to bounce ideas off of people and understanding.

It's a hard conversation. Between parents and their children. It's maybe it's hard for schools to take on this conversation as well, but Well now, I mean. Well now exactly. And so, you know, is there a space that we can create that help these conversations come to life and help these questions that everybody has be answered with reliable, scientifically backed.

Information. And so that's truly a goal for us as well. And we, we always want gems to feel like this older sibling you can go to to sort of have questions or just be a part of a more open and expansive conversation around sex. I love that. So getting into some of the more like brass tack of the toxic actual ingredients, because I'm willing to bet that if people listen to this show, Their minds are already open because I truly feel like my mission with, with what I'm doing is to tackle shame and to try and, and dismantle that, whether it's from listening to other people's stories, learning from educators, being entertained slowly, getting people to feel accustomed to these conversations about female pleasure, equitable pleasure.

Kinks. A. A, any of it. But I am, I would bet my money that the people listening don't know how toxic lubes, spermicides condoms actually are. Yeah, definitely. I think there's, you know, there's, there's toxic ingredients and then there's irritating ingredients. The reason we chose silicon silicone is it's the longest lasting, it's effectively inert. So it doesn't cause, um, a reaction or a change on your pH levels, which is, particularly for Volvo is very important. Um, you know, bacterial vaginosis is something that I think we are starting to talk about a lot more, and I think something that's been.

Probably underrepresented because people again, don't feel like they can talk about it or comfortable feeling talking about it. But, so this idea of silicone lube, being inert and not having impact on your pH is really important. Some of the ingredients to really watch out for are benzocaine, which is that numbing agent, you know, so if you see fire in ICE or extended pleasure, Those are kind of, that's just this numbing agent that is supposed to enhance pleasure.

And it might for some, but it can also, cause so much reaction. And the problem is if you if you can't quite tell that it's in the, condom, you don't even know what you're buying, what you're signing up for. So that's something that we've eliminated and then, Flavors, colors and preservatives are the next on the list that would be ingredients that could cause irritations as well.

Where do parabens fit in the mix? So that would be a preservative. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. So typically the reason parabens exist are, are for preservatives reasons. And again, you don't need preservatives when you're just using latex and silicone. You would need a preservative for another ingredient, um, that we don't use.

And so there's just no need for it. And I think like for. Vva owners, like the big thing, at least for me, so I have some health issues. like I have Hashimotos and I have chronic fatigue. So I've, at various times in my life had to dial in endocrine disruptors, right? And parabens fall into that. So like anything that is scented or certain types of plastics, things like that can actually.

Disrupt or fuck up, like my endocrine system, which, you know, hormones, women or women identifying, I mean, I, it probably affects men too. I, I just am so, you know, focused on me, uh, for sure. That, that, like, I know, oh, this can really wreak havoc and, I know there's a listener that has endometriosis and mm-hmm.

For people like that, endocrine disruptors are a real, a real nightmare. And it's one thing that you can control. Exactly. No, that's exactly it. As I mentioned earlier, there's a small percentage of people who are allergic to latex, so we can't actually call GEMS toxic free because to those with latex allergies, they would be toxic. Sure. However, something we've learned is that the percentage of those who are ele allergic to latex is actually very, very small and.

Some people assume that they're having a reaction to the latex, but in fact they're having a reaction to one of the other ingredients in condoms that of course isn't listed and is not identifiable, but. They're assuming it's latex. So that's something we try and share as well. And you know, not to say that we're convincing people to use latex no matter what, but it might be worth another shot just to make sure it's, it's in fact the latex that is, the allergy.

It's virtually impossible to advertise condoms online unless you are a big pay to play company, and everyday sexual education accounts are being shadow banned or removed because there's this movement to dismantle sexual education in this country right now. So what are you guys doing offline to try and promote a paradigm shift, like in the way that condoms are seen and treated?

I have to say that retailers have really embraced gems. They. Have been quick to understand this white space that exists in the market and that there is a need for change.

And so, and that's been across the board, bigger retailers, smaller retailers. part of the conversation that we're having with them too is going beyond the condom aisle. So Whitney always says it's, you know, you take this product in the worst packaging, you put it in the worst aisle. In the grocery store and you're wondering why people feel uncomfortable, uh, going to make this purchase.

So we are trying to find ways in which we can have condoms alongside other daily needs. So is it sun? Screen, is it hand sanitizer, lip gloss, things that, you know, you sort of have those moments of joy even when you go to pick up the things that you need, um, that's part of your routine. Can you put condoms there as well?

Can you merchandise them in a way that it feels comfortable and open and accept it? And part of what we've done is these silicone cases that. Can actually fit a three pack inside, and they're a great way to store condoms. Again, we talk about how do you store condoms safely? You don't want them to get punctured or degrade over time, and so get them outta your back pocket, get them out of your wallet.

And these silicone cases are a great protective way to do that, but it also helps retailers merchandise them a little bit differently. So there's this lifestyle play of these are fun and cute and pick them up. It's part of what you need. In your everyday life. And that's all there is to it. And so, um, 

we see it as retailers' responsibilities to actually help this change come along and, and normalize buying condoms, especially in a climate where, you know, choices are being restricted.

Yeah. And you're packaging for people that don't know is brightly colored. Mm-hmm. The font is kind of like bubbly font. It feels. Very, um, youthful. And I love that idea of. Literally repositioning it in a store to help reposition it in people's minds. Exactly. That's exactly it. 

For somebody that is uncomfortable, whether they're. 15, 35 70 using or wanting to use a condom or feeling uncomfortable having unprotected sex, do you guys have any tips to broach that conversation?

The same way that you would ask somebody to, you would assume somebody has washed their hands. I think there's like a wellness part to it. You don't have to think of it as, you know, if you're inquiring about the condom that says anything about how many sexual partners you have or anything else.

It's like this is the bare minimum of what we do to keep us safe and healthy and enjoyable. And that is not a very good tip. coming at it from the pleasure angle feels like the right, way to approach it if it's an uncomfortable topic. 

I think you've touched on that, on that so nicely, this idea that, um, when your partner chose to take a precaution, it actually said more about who they are as a partner, as a sexual partner and how they, were as a partner.

And so I think this idea of like, Safer sex is actually a form of enhancing pleasure, which is, a much better way to frame it. 

Yeah, I think it's a respect issue. Mm-hmm. Um, there's like a self-respect issue and a respect for your partner issue. Like for me personally, and I guess my advice would be like the default is there is the default.

Like if, yeah, if you, whoever's listening are always prepared and you just whip out a condom, it becomes a conversation. Either it's not a conversation and you just use a condom or it becomes a conversation. And if your partner is like, Oh, I don't like condoms or they're uncomfortable or I can't last as long.

You know? I think that is a real moment to realize this person's probably not going to give you the orgasm that you think you're going to get. That Absolutely. I think there's also. No, absolutely. I think exactly, and I think that's so sad too of like, again, there's this emphasis on performance that condoms seem to play into for some reason.

And you know, that's just so unfortunate. The other element is there's this idea of broadening what sex is and the fact that condoms can play a role in. Broadening any sexual experiences. So are you having intercourse? Are you moving to anal? Are you playing with toys? And often in order to do that safely and hygienically, condoms are necessary.

And so that's another reason why, you know, you're not just talking about it from unwanted pregnancies or STI prevention, you're saying this is, this is gonna help contribute to an amazing sexual experience. And you know you're gonna wanna have a few on hand. Yeah, totally. 

I ask everyone that comes on the show this. What is your best love advice? What's the best love advice you've ever received? 

I think the best advice I've ever heard in regards to love is you have to have respect for another person and feel respect to yourself because I think that you can't have anything, whether it's. Fun or joy or deep intimacy without, I know that's a really boring answer, but it's actually, for me, it's the truth.

I feel attracted to someone when I have a deep respect for them and I feel my best version of myself when I feel like someone is deeply respecting me. I love that. I think this is actually more pertains to sex maybe than love, but, um, something that I, it took me. Longer in my life to realize than I wish I had known sooner was to think about my pleasure wasn't actually selfish.

It was actually better for both of us in order if we were making, you know, making our needs and wants known. And hearing, like expressing that and responding to that made it better. Whereas I think I was in the sort of, Mindset of like focusing on their pleasure first and putting that first, which led to less good time for both of us.

Oh, so I wish I knew that. Yeah. Earlier. Yeah. Oh my God, yes. Uh, 150%. Yes. I can totally relate to that. And I also think, you know, I was just talking to a friend of mine who. Was talking about being really unsatisfied in her current relationship sexually, and I think something that was fascinating to me is that she's not a hundred percent dialed in on her own pleasure and her own journey. And I was saying like, listen, I, I, I think all of your criticisms are totally valid and your partner should absolutely want to. See you reach fulfillment and enjoyment, but I also think there is something to being able to know how to help them.

Exactly. Like when you give, it's, it's, I mean, the kind of a theme of this conversation is like when you're handing your agency over to another person, oftentimes you're going to be disappointed. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. You're asking them to, to mind read or body read or whatever the case may be. Yeah. Mind read, body read, and, and I.

I kind of love that we're ending on this because it does tie into sexual health, sexual wellness, and pleasure, which is like ties into the condoms, like mm-hmm. I think that when you hand over that choice, or. If you are being influenced to have sex without protection and it's not something that you actually want to do, again, you're handing over your agency and you're really rolling the dice and yeah, STIs are not the end of the world.

It's not about that. But I do think there is something about. When you do that, you slowly chip away at self-confidence. Yes. And self-respect. And it's a bigger issue than just, oh, I slept this, this person unprotected, and now maybe I'm going to have something be as a result. I think it's a deeper, it's something deeper and it's, it, it's like, At least for me right now, I feel very empowered to try and help other people feel empowered and like not feel embarrassed about owning the fact that they want to enjoy pleasure.

Mm-hmm. And they wanna enjoy sex, but they also want to do it safely. And that if something comes up, it's not that they're gross or dirty or wrong or bad. It's the price of admission, baby. It is. It is. Exactly. And that's why we, we always say safer sex. Listen, there is no such thing as entirely safe sex, but the goal is safer sex.

Right. And whatever that means. So, oh my God, the pursuit of love is one of the most dangerous things that we can do. Ab I'm me. Absolutely. Are you kidding me? It's called heartbreak for a fucking reason. Exactly. Yeah. I don't know. It's all risky. And I mean, I guess that's part of the fun too. 

I think we are going to, we're gonna do a giveaway, for some gems products for some of the listeners. Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. Amazing. I love that. Um, there, there is the listener that I referenced who has endometriosis. Yeah, I'd really love to hook her up with gems because I think part of her journey in getting rid of endocrine disruptors, this would be like a really amazing step.

Absolutely. That would be great. We can, we'd love to send her. If people want to buy the product, learn from the website. Like, where do people find you? Where do people find gems? So gems for all.com is our website and it's also where you can find out which select Target locations gems can be found at.

But we are available online, across the country and at GEMS for All is our Instagram and TikTok handle. Do you guys ship? So like if I technically didn't wanna ever go into a store, I could have them shipped to my house. Yes, yes. So our gems for all.com website, you can order anything you want.

And same with Target. Amazing. I love that. Thank you so, so, so, so much. Um, this has been a great conversation and I now need to get a bunch because I've let some toxic dudes up But I think that it's time to stop with the toxic chemicals. Gems is here for you. I love it. It's got convert.