Crazy Love Lessons with Rachel Bloom

[00:19:30] 

[00:19:30] Wow. I mean, What's crazy is like, I knew where it was going and obviously I forgot. And then as I was listening to it, I was like, this is insane. This is insane. It made me wanna flip the table. Well, it comes from his parents. Clearly. He's cr I mean, if the parents are charging her for breakfast, right?

[00:19:44] That's his mother relaying, Hey. So she ate a piece of bread and a banana. So he's, he's been taught wrong by his parents. I didn't even think about that because cuz that's the parents, he's not keeping track of that. The parents are, It's so funny because I've been with my husband for 15 years and we've been married for eight.

[00:20:03] I lost track. So you, well, I read your book. So, so you combine your finances, right? Yes, yes. Yes. So you combine your finances. The,

[00:20:13] the idea of, I, I have to hope that if this guy got married, the idea of like, you owe me, I, I. You used four diapers today. Like, I, I don't even know what that would be. We did, I did keep track of money early in our [00:20:30] relationship. It was more of a guilt on my end cuz he paid for a lot of stuff. Mm. But because I was still in college, I've been with him for a long time.

[00:20:36] Yeah. So I was still in college. He was his early, in his mid twenties, but to a college student that was like a billionaire. Yeah, that's like an adult, I mean. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So there was a lot of, there was an imbalance and then, When we got together, he was still making more money. So there were times we'd, we'd, I was always covering a disproportionately small amount of the rent and sometimes he'd spot me.

[00:20:57] yeah, I mean, the idea And was it ever, I mean, was that ever a big deal? No, it wasn't. It wasn't. He was just minchi. Hmm. You just get miny and I think that if you're strapped for cash, you talk about it. Yeah. This guy's insane. And his parents are insane and clearly, I don't know if they grew up, could you imagine if I came welfare over to your house and I brought wine and then later they charged me for it and then later I sent you a Venmo request.

[00:21:23] This guy is so, I, I'd love to know, you know, there's this. I feel like the improv term is like if, then what [00:21:30] else? Okay. Right. There had to have been other weird, this guy's not just like a normal guy and he does this, he's doing other weird shit. I know. I kind of, I asked questions about that and it didn't seem like it.

[00:21:42] I mean, I know that he was very driven and like top of his class in the top finance program at this school, but. Did he come from being extremely poor? Yes. So, okay. That's why. Yeah, but I think that, look, that makes sense, I guess. But if it's gonna be an egal look, I get it. Okay. It's an egalitarian relationship.

[00:22:02] You're gonna split everything out in the middle if he's gonna charge her. For being at his parents' house, then he should, she should be then he then he should volunteer. I'm gonna pay you for your parents when we go to your parents' house. Yeah. And he's not doing that. I know. So that's the hypocrisy, because if that's the way you see the world, great.

[00:22:18] Then you're gonna volunteer to Venmo or, or e-transfer to her then. Right. But he never did that. No. So I also think it's. When she, there was like a little line where she goes, and it was a bad financial decision [00:22:30] because I was always e transferring to him, so I never got the point. he was ahead of her and a finance guy.

[00:22:34] He knew exactly what he was doing. He's, you know, raking in all these points and then getting reimbursed. He's double dipping in a way. The whole thing is wild. But also, I wanna know, when he ghosted her, I dated a guy like this. Really? Yeah. It was kind of cold. And then he like ghosted me and I basically was like, you're breaking up with me.

[00:22:53] Right. And like, I kind of forced him to actually break up with me. Please have a conversation. And he had a lot of issues. I mean, he, it was, he was a, a repressed person. So, look, I've been in, I've been with the same guy for 15 years. So dating advice is, I, I was never on an app. Oh my God. I mean, that, that's how long I've been with my husband.

[00:23:10] Yeah. But that is so sick. That's that's incredible. I've never been, I've never, I, I, you know, I, I would say I took the lazy way out, but he's just the guy that I found in, in college. I wish I could have done it both ways. Like I'm so glad that I've been able to have all of the experiences I've had, and I've had so many, like terrible, terrible, terrible ones.

[00:23:28] But even those have [00:23:30] been exciting or they've taught me a lot of things, but I had this thought as I was. Thinking about your life and I was like, man, I really wish I could have done both. it's really cool that you've been able to spend so much of your life with the same person. I just think that that's awesome.

[00:23:45] Yeah, it's wonderful. But it's, I don't ever try to give relationship advice cuz I just got lucky. Like, I don't think it's a testament to, I mean, I'm sure there's, we work on our relationship and Yeah. But we were friends first. We just naturally. Click. Mm-hmm. When we work on our relationship, obviously, especially since we've had a kid, I'm sure we, we, we are, we are extremely communicative, but at a certain point I just, I found the guy.

[00:24:08] Mm-hmm. Because my guys before that were not the guy, so we've heard Yeah. Yeah. And any kind of, it's funny cuz I made a show all about dating and those stories were very much taken from my early, early twenties. Mm-hmm. And then kind of yes. Ended. My second improv term. I don't know what's wrong with me, but it kind of extrapolated.

[00:24:29] Yeah. [00:24:30] Um, and my writing partner, Alene, was uh, had been with her husband since her late twenties. And so I am, I have a very, um, very basic bitch Midwestern life in, in, in a way, having been with the same guy. And I hear about these. Oh, these actors in these relationships and they're always cheating on each other.

[00:24:48] And I, I just heard of a, I don't know, a recent writer. I kind of a writer, filmmaker I kind of know who don't cheat on her husband. She's with another person now. And I was like, what did, what, what are vows? You made a vow. Oh my gosh, I'm so very, uh, yeah, if you're gonna, and if you want an open relationship, I was just fucking say that.

[00:25:08] I, I think what's crazy about that, like right now, in 2023 is it has never been more acceptable. It has never been more like, Normal, mainstream, whatever, have you to be in an open relationship. Yes. And so there is no I, I had, I was talking to someone a couple years ago who confided in me. He was like, I don't know if I'm meant for monogamy.

[00:25:26] And I went, you don't have to be. No, you don't. There's a thing called being poly. [00:25:30] Yeah. And you can opt to be in relationships with people who are also poly. There are apps for that, specifically for that. Yeah. Unless you get off on being in a monogamous relationship and cheating. Which is a whole other, which is a whole other thing, which is not being in an open relationship, and so I'm very kind of, Midwestern, but, but I'm like, if you wanna be a poly, just be poly.

[00:25:49] Yeah. But if you're gonna, but if you're gonna make a vow, you make a vow. You know, I would never, ever describe you as Midwestern or, what did you say? Basic bitch. I guess. I guess I just, I believe in being ethical in this and, and I believe in being ethical and the way that fancy actors and even not fancy actors, just Yeah.

[00:26:07] Through friends and friends of friends. People in Hollywood just are terrible in their relationships because they're, they feel it, oh, I God, I had kissed this person. Cause I feel it. What do you not feel guilt, sir? I mean, I would love to ask a lot of people that, and they, and they don't. I also have a crippling sense of guilt.

[00:26:27] Like if I were to ever do anything I would, I would feel [00:26:30] so guilty. Which, which goes into my feelings of ocd. Like they definitely overlap. Of course. Yeah. So there are some people out there who just don't have my. Kind of, guilt bordering, bordering on intense anxiety and I and I that I think you succeeded in spite of not being a psychopath in Yes.

[00:26:47] I should put that on a card. Yeah, please do. But yeah, this thing of nickel and diming, it's so interesting. It's so crazy to me. I also, the, the bread flag to me is not telling the friends. If I have, yeah, whenever, if you're not telling your friends, you know that, you know deep, you know, they go, what? Yeah.

[00:27:04] But also she didn't seem to be super into this guy. So that's my other question to her. Is she, she together for like two years and a half years and they, well, they were like hooking up, off and on for a year. That's a long time. Mm-hmm. And then together as boyfriend and girlfriend for, it sounds like two years, I think it was three.

[00:27:20] So I, I guess that's my question to her is, Ooh. Why? I know. I was like, where do you get the chill? I've never been that chilling. Any [00:27:30] relationship ever, ever. But at some point, if you're not happy with this guy, you probably developed a crush on another person. And at what point she did point she, that's the thing.

[00:27:36] I think she really, when, when I was talking to her about this earnestly, honestly, she's like, I see it now. It's weird. Hmm. But she was young. I think she was impressionable and I think she was in it and just did not know. It's like sometimes you don't know how toxic things are until you're out of it. This guy I talk about in my book, The condom broke.

[00:27:57] And by the way, I had a very similar story. So we went to the drugstore, cuz this is, it wasn't over the counter. You had to ask the pharmacist morning after pill. Mm-hmm. And he found out the cost. The cost was what, a hundred dollars. This guy, guy was four years older than I was. He was definitely in a more financially well off spot.

[00:28:12] And he, he was like a hundred dollars. And he, that was the moment our relationship changed. I mean, this is a whole other thing cuz we were in like a secret relationship, but Sure. He was very bitter that I didn't have the money to pay for the morning after pill. He was also Catholic and so I think felt shitty.

[00:28:25] We were doing the morning after pill at all. What, but no, he really [00:28:30] shamed me for how much The morning after Bill Coston, it hit the, the, to the, the tone as if you are, as if you wanted to take it a do it. Darkness came over his face and the relationship never recovered. This is not my husband. Yeah, obviously.

[00:28:43] Obviously you have to clarify that. That's Wow. Yeah. That's a moment for sure. Yeah. Holy cow. Catholic. All boys school, then he shouldn't be having sex. Well, yeah, like if you can't be nice to people or realize that you are an equal participant, then don't participate. Yeah. Yeah. Most people need intense therapy.

[00:29:05] There should just be mandatory therapy. That's for everyone. That's the conclusion I always come to, and it's like a broken record and. I, I talk about, I talk about this so much, but I just, mandatory therapy. I know. It, it, it is a real cool through line in I think a lot of your work we're messed up. Yeah. We are all messed up.

[00:29:23] I don't think there's a single person who doesn't need at least a year of therapy in the world. Yeah, Or, or. More [00:29:30] or way more? Yeah. Or way more. Yeah. I mean, should they put Prozac in the water? Probably. Could you imagine? My psychiatrist said, I was like, I love Prozac. She goes, oh, they should just put it in the water.

[00:29:40] Right. That's hilarious. okay, well, switching gears a little bit, said you were a sex obsessed child. Yeah. And I love this detail that you weren't like, Other sex obsessed children. You were the kind that read books. Yeah. My parents were very encouraging of literacy in our household, and I didn't have a ton of friends.

[00:30:00] So at the time, the mall, I, I grew up next to a mall, but like a tiny mall. Now it's a big mall, but back then it was a tiny mall, I'm aware, and one of its few stores. Oh, you know the exact mall? Of course. Course. Yeah. So there was a be, there was a a, a Bee Dalton bookstore. And I would just spend hours reading wow books and there was a whole like adolescent sex book section. And so I read a lot about sexuality from the adolescent sex books and it gave me a very healthy relationship with sex from doing that.

[00:30:27] Really? Yeah. That's incredible. Yeah, [00:30:30] I feel pretty, good about. When I lost my virginity, I mean, I also, I, you know, have the luck to not be one of what is one in four women in the US are assaulted uhhuh. I have the luck to not be one of, I think the stat is actually one in the unofficial stat based on a very prominent treatment center is one and two.

[00:30:47] So I have, it's really dark, so I'm very lucky to not be. One of those one and two. Mm-hmm. So putting that aside, yeah. I also knew a lot about how sex worked. I just, I don't know. I read a lot about it. My parents were honest, not like too honest, but when I asked questions, they answered, and I lost my virginity when I, I lost my virginity.

[00:31:05] In college, we used a condom, like I was always just very responsible because I knew about it. I don't know how you lost your virginity, but you took someone's virginity with someone in the room and I lost my virginity in by, wait, I took someone's virginity. Oh, yes, yes, yes, yes. There's someone in the room.

[00:31:21] Yes, yes, yes. Yeah. The, if you'll have to get a book and read it, it's amazing. Um, but there's a part where you talk about, Taking a guy's virginity. And your roommate was in the room? Yes. [00:31:30] And I laughed because I lost my virginity in a, in the bottom bunk of a bunk bed and someone was sleeping on top.

[00:31:35] Perfect. And I was like, oh, look at that. Yep. Yeah. You don't have a lot of space when you're young. No, you don't. Yeah, I know what I, I look back on that now. I'm like, that was, what an insane. Do I say that in the book that I took? Someone's virginity? You do? Yeah. I don't know if she was in the room at the time.

[00:31:51] It was definitely in the room I shared with my college roommate. Was she in the room? Eh? That might be a lie. Okay. Mom. For comedic effect. I definitely had sex with someone, but I had sex with someone in the same room. Sure, yeah. Yeah. I mean, I feel like, man, college. College man. Oof. Yeah. I did not spend a lot of time there cuz I'm a college drop up or whatever.

[00:32:08] Going back to what I was just saying, I think something that struck me as. Just so on brand with this podcast is so you felt pretty confident in your sexuality and you'd read all of these books and you knew how to pleasure yourself? Yes. And there's two things. One, you say sex is not Taboo in America, but pleasure is.

[00:32:29] I read that, that [00:32:30] was a quote I read, I think from a woman who maybe owns like a sex shop in France or something. I think that's a hundred percent sex is fine because that's. To be trite. The patriarchy, right? That's penis and vagina, that's sex. Right? Pleasure. The idea of the idea, or I'm sorry, penis and vagina, that's procreation for sure.

[00:32:49] Right. So that's, that's like religious. Yeah. Pleasure. For the sake of pleasure is Yes. And especially when it comes to female pleasure because a woman doesn't have to have an orgasm in order to make a baby. Yeah. And yeah. And all. So why would it, ma, why would it matter? So why the fact that they're, that women have a body part solely reserved for pleasure.

[00:33:05] How dare we, how dare they? It is a, it's a, it's a weird and also thing also, I don't get it. It's a fucking button. What do I fucking do? I just, I don't do I go, boo boo boo. Oh, that doesn't work. I don't wanna figure it out. Now. I guess something's wrong with you. Well, that's the thing is, so I'd read all these books that were like, clitoris, clitoris, clitoris.

[00:33:21] Yes. And so I, how to masturbate from a book. It was like, girls will massage their clitoris. And I was like, oh, I'd never tried that. And then I tried it when I was like 11 and a half I remember. And I was [00:33:30] like, this is what I'm doing for the rest of my life. This is the best thing in the world.

[00:33:32] It wasn't until I started, becoming sexually active. Yeah. And I didn't know any better. I'd been masturbating and I said, guy to guys, you know, touch my clitoris and they'd say, oh, you're tricky. And I was like, wait. All of the books I read when I was 12, 13. And this is how it's done. This is how it's done.

[00:33:51] So I was almost reverse shamed cuz I went into it thinking I was normal and knowing I was normal. And then guys, because they'd been, I with so many women with faking orgasms, thought I was, uh, ooh. You're, ooh, you're, oh, you're, wow, you're different. You're a difficult one. Yeah. I can't believe you got gas lit.

[00:34:08] By all the women who lied to all the men before you were with them. Yeah. Like that's crazy to me. Had I not, I mean, look, had I not read a book about my clitoris, would I eventually have figured it out? Probably, yeah, probably. But later I didn't really figure it out until. My like mid twenties. So that makes sense.

[00:34:26] Right. If you don't know, and also you're taught you should come from sex. I mean, I, [00:34:30] I'm trying to write a show about the cli. I have a, I literally have a sketch show about the clitoris that was like with a network and then they passed of course. And I'm trying to put it somewhere else, but it's a bad time for sketch right now.

[00:34:38] And always a bad time for clitoris is. Um, but the clitoris is amazing because the nerves go way, way, underneath. Yeah. And so what a lot of scientists, it's like, it's like that iceberg poster. It's iceberg. It looks like a penguin. Yeah. So any, even if you quote unquote come from sex. Right. Just a penis in your vagina or something In your vagina.

[00:34:55] Yeah. Still that what that actually is, is it's the nerves of your clitoris extend long enough into your vagina that that can actually, you can come from that alone, but it's all the clitoris. Yeah. It's just depending on your anatomy. And some people are aor I think an orgasmic can't orgasm at all. and we should have acceptance for that too.

[00:35:11] And this, this prize of the idea of orgasm being the most important part of sex is also very of the patriarchy. Because for men it is, it, it climaxes to this explosion. But like, so if I can only come from clitoral stimulation, does that mean I don't like penetration? No. But even though like penetration isn't the only means to my [00:35:30] end, my end, like I still like it.

[00:35:32] Yeah. Yeah. So there are just so many, I mean, I, I could go on and on about this topic, but it comes from a place of reading, being allowed to read books as a kid of what was normal, and then having otherwise enlightened guys, you know, guys who attended the Tish School of the Arts at nyu. Say like the what?

[00:35:47] Yeah. I mean that was a lot of my experience too, and I found that women, like my girlfriends and I didn't really talk about it, or I look back on those conversations and realize, I think we were all just lying to each other. There's a lot of shame. Yeah. Lot. Or we just didn't know. Like I would have an experience that was maybe like better than the rest.

[00:36:03] And now I would look back and be like, oh, that would, I would never include that in like, it wasn't that great, but it was better than whatever had happened at the time. And so then I would think that that was, that that was it, or that was, that was me having good sex. And it was like, wow. I was just really fumbling in the dark there.

[00:36:20] Yeah. I had read some of the same books there. There are really good books out there, but I never discussed it. I mean, I, I, when I was, oh, I [00:36:30] wrote the Forward for this book called Moan, which is a book compiled by my friend Emma. K. Yeah, yeah. Oh yeah. It was amazing Orgasm. She's amazing. And I wrote the Forward for it, and my mother bought the book and she's like, oh, I, I saw you read the book and it was interesting.

[00:36:42] And to my own mother, we were, I don't know, we were talking about sex raykin. And I said, you know, all orgasms come from the clitoris. And my mom without throwing under the bus. She was like, really? Oh, oh my God. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. Like there, there was this dawning of, wait, it's not me. Crazy. And I think that's a lot of people, lot of women.

[00:37:05] I did a. before the pandemic, I did this interview with this doc, this sex therapist, Dr. Lori Mintz, who's amazing. And I did an interview with her at UCLA for all UCLA students. And this is, you know, gen Z. Like they're pretty with it. And some of the stuff she was saying about the clitoris and pleasure, it was blowing these people's minds.

[00:37:22] And they were, you know, they have full access to the internet, but even they are confused, but also full access to the internet. [00:37:30] So, I interviewed, the CEO of Dame products. Mm. The vibrator company love Dame Al's. Amazing. the restrictions that are placed on female pleasure are so extreme that. You don't really have the same access.

[00:37:43] It isn't as normalized because you're allowed to advertise for condoms. But if it says ribbed for her pleasure, that's illegal. There's, there's so much censorship Interesting. That's happening Yeah. Online right now that it actually isn't that shocking that it still feels, um, that there's still an air of shame.

[00:38:01] Yeah, because we see. Ads for erection pills or, a lot of stuff geared toward men and not for women. So it still does feel a little shame-based. Yeah, and it's also, that's who. Ran the world for and continues to run The world, ran the world hundreds of thousands of years. And, and, and again, the idea of to procreate, you need the male orgasm, but you do not need the female orgasm for procreation.

[00:38:26] Yeah. Now, theoretically, I've heard that the female [00:38:30] orgasm actually like, does theoretically push sperm toward the uterus water, but, but just let's, for the purposes of this, assume male orgasms are prized because that's how you get babies. Yeah, that makes total sense. That a then a vibrator company that's just for female pleasure, which has nothing to do with proative sex, which the Puritans who founded this country, which also country by the way, works for couples that aren't just heterosexual cis, you know, male female of course.

[00:38:54] I think we're just like, it's, yeah, it's still rooted in this idea of sexes for procreation. That's just what it's for.

[00:39:01] So annoying. And I say this as someone who made a baby with sex, which is still blows my mind. Oh my gosh. You talking about masturbating while pregnant? Had me literally laughing on the plane. Oh yeah. I forget what I said, but Just that you hope that she's kind of like off in a far off land, like on Oh yeah.

[00:39:19] She goes away tree when she comes, goes away. She goes away in a, she goes away in a cloud When I was masturbating, when I was pregnant and then she comes back. It's a very weird, I mean, being pregnant is so interesting. That's true and weird. Your body is your body, [00:39:30] but it's not your body. And I was pregnant for a very short period of time, and the craziest thing that ever happened to me was, Two days after I got pregnant, I started having insane body dysmorphia, but I didn't know I was pregnant.

[00:39:40] And it like, no, was like the scariest thing that's ever happened to me. Like I would look in the mirror. You've ever been on mushrooms? Yeah. You know when you're on mushrooms and you look in the mirror and like, you know it's you, but you look grotesque. Yeah. Like you just can't figure it out. That was me.

[00:39:52] Every waking moment, oh my God. To the point where I started emailing people, like I was like, I don't know, like something is wrong. Whoa. And then when I figured out I was pregnant, I was like, holy shit. Like it literally was immediate. It was the craziest, craziest thing that I've ever experienced. Yeah, that's wild.

[00:40:09] Yeah, absolutely wild. So when women talk about pregnancy being a trip, I'm like, yeah. And in my case it felt literal. Yeah. It happened for, that's so interesting. Yeah. And this was like day two, right? Yeah, day two. Nuts. It's all wild. Full nuts. 

[00:41:07] You made a show that in at one point you talked about was. The intention was to be like a takedown of, love and romantic obsession. Yes. do you still feel that way? Yeah. Yes, I do. Well, it's complicated. We never got this in the show because the show became so much more about. In a good way, mental health. But one of the original inspirations for what Crazy Ex-Girlfriend was was this Ted Talk by this, I wanna say she's a biological anthropologist named Helen Fisher.

[00:41:34] Mm-hmm. Who has studied love and, she's put people in love under MRIs. And TED Talk she talks about how when you are in love, and, and this is, we're talking about like you can't eat, you think about this person all the time. It's, is that love or is that lust? So, no. So it's commonly, it's basically having a crush, right?

[00:41:52] Yeah. Okay. A crush. But we call it falling in love. Sure. Yes. So the kind of scientificy term for it is lence. Mm-hmm. It's the actual term for being in the throes of obsession. And when you scan someone's brain, it's, it's akin to someone having obsessive [00:42:07] compulsive disorder and being on and or being on cocaine.

[00:42:09] Cocaine, yeah. Because your serotonin levels drop and your dopamine spikes when you think about this person or when you're around this person. Yeah. And so, sorry, side note to someone with, Low serotonin, which is why I'm on Prozac. That's why love was particularly falling in love was particularly like disastrous for me.

[00:42:28] Yeah. Because if my serotonin's already low and then it dropped, it would be even more. I truly needed these people to complete who I was. That's, that is. No wonder your twenties were brutal. Yes. For dating. Like yeah. That's why they, they stick. That's why they really, really stuck with me. I don't know.

[00:42:45] Falling in love is, but I also fell in love with my husband and I felt lis for my husband. Really? And I did. And for me, the way I felt Lis was though, like the constant fear it was gonna go away. Mm-hmm. Like I never, I had to ease into not feeling that way. Kind of. You didn't trust that it was gonna work out?

[00:43:03] No. Whoa. But that's also, when did that go away? Mm, [00:43:07] when? Okay. Uh, Couple months after we said we loved each other, we went rock climbing and repelling. Mm-hmm. Because he liked the outdoors. And I pretended to, and yeah. I was like, ow, I didn't, didn't see that for you. I went rock climbing and it was actually pretty fun.

[00:43:19] And then, but the repelling part, I kept bumping into the rocks and I was like, ow, ow, ow. And I realized after that day if he can love me, even after he's watched me do outdoorsy stuff and get banged up, maybe this is, I don't need to worry anymore. Mm. It didn't affect it. It moved, I think at that point into a different kind of lence.

[00:43:41] Yeah, because like basically this idea that love conquers all is really, uh, It's like really problematic because having a crush on someone or falling in love with someone, sometimes they're also a good person for your long-term happiness and sometimes they aren't. Yeah. And Mother Nature, Helen Fisher says in her talk, mother Nature doesn't care if you're happy.

[00:43:58] Mother Nature just wants you to reproduce. Mm-hmm. And that's even, that's, that's like a kind of base thing for Cis people, trans people, gay people, straight people. It's like at the base of it, at [00:44:07] the like lizard brain of it is like theoretically reproduction, I guess at the very, very, very lizard brain.

[00:44:13] I'm not an expert. I could be wrong. Yeah. Sex has, sex has, I'm so curious if that's still true. Sex has so many other purposes. But anyway, that's what Helen Fisher says in this talk and this idea of no matter what causes it, that it's something almost involuntary that happens that also is. A little bit based in the thrill of the chase.

[00:44:30] Mm-hmm. It's a little bit of a mating dance and it's why people who seem out of reach are very attractive is because Totally. We are totally. It's that dopamine. Yeah. It's like why? It's why romantic comedies aren't ever about them living happily ever after. We like watching the Will there won, won't they?

[00:44:45] Yeah. Yeah. It's like embedded in our DNA to like the chase, because that's falling in love. Mm-hmm. That's thrilling. That's that. I don't know. I guess Helen Fisher would say that reproduction urge, again, I'm super behind on the science, so I could be It's fine. It's fine. Very wrong, but this is what she says in that TED talk.

[00:45:00] So I think it depends on the person. If you're falling in love with a person who ultimately makes your [00:45:07] life better and is a good person, it's very romantic. you're falling in love with a toxic person who maybe mirrors some toxic patterns you've had, or a toxic pattern with your parents you've had, yeah, maybe that's not so good.

[00:45:19] Right. And it kind of seems like you had that a little bit when you were younger and then you had a moment where you say you decided to opt out of the fairytale. yeah, I really into that part. Part of it is luck. I fell in love with a good person, but I think maybe part of the reason I fell in love with that was in reaction to shittiness.

[00:45:39] And for the first time, I was maybe attracted to someone. Who had a healthy way of looking at things. Mm-hmm. Yeah, I relate to that. I like recently just kind of took myself out of the game. I got off all dating apps. Mm-hmm. I'm just like, not as interested. Not that I'm not interested, I'm just not participating in kind of the game part.

[00:46:00] Mm-hmm. And I do think dating and, and love has been gamified in a certain, to a certain extent. Oh my gosh. The a [00:46:07] all of it. It's a lot. The, the game, the apps, the. It's like gambling in so many ways. Right? And I felt like I was kind of daisy chaining from situation to situation. And it was, I felt that kind of, um, dopamine rush, adrenaline, that, that, and it felt toxic, so I just kind of stopped.

[00:46:29] And part of it was also just hitting such a low, low, low point that I was forced to. Deal with my feelings of inadequacy to deal with my feelings of like, just like not being good enough and trauma from, you know, middle school that has like stayed with things like that. And I do think weirdly confronting that made me just a better partner.

[00:46:54] Like I don't know who I'm gonna end up with next. Yeah. But falling in love with myself. Made it a lot easier to just walk away from the game of dating and also made me excited for like, whoever comes next. As [00:47:07] RuPaul said, you can't love yourself. How the hell are you gonna love somebody else? That's what he says at the end of every episode.

[00:47:12] That's a great, although I think that's wrong in that if you can't love yourself, you all, you could absolutely love someone else. Yes. It's really how, how the hell are you gonna healthily? Yeah. Love somebody else. A participant in that. Yeah. I, I. I fully agree with that. I have some questions, some speed round cues for that.

[00:47:31] Great. I love it. What's your favorite killer move? Like a move that you make that always works on your husband, I guess? Oh, for like sex and love? Well, it could also, it didn't have to be, I mean, yes, for most people it's more normally like how do you slide into the dms or, yeah.

[00:47:47] Because the two times that I ever asked out guys, I was turned down. So Rachel? Yeah. Yeah. So my killer move is being a woman in comedy. Again, this is like, I haven't been single since my early twenties, so, I, I don't the two, I'm, I'm, yeah, no, they, I asked them out, they [00:48:07] turn, no, I think three, three guys.

[00:48:08] I asked out three guys. They all turn me down. They just said, no thank you. They were like, uh, maybe, yeah, I am. Mad. So what's my killer move is, I have no idea. I love it. Okay. What makes for a killer date An effortless, effortless conversation. I love that. Yeah. Effortless conversation with revelations sprinkled into it.

[00:48:30] Yes. Cosign. Yeah. Date killer.

[00:48:33] A guy who makes an Excel spreadsheet for how much he owes, how much you owe him. Oh my God. 3 25. That's disgusting for a slice of wonderful bread and a banana. Ugh. Also, I don't even think that's accurate. No, that would be way less. Way less, yeah. Right. You'd It would be, well, a vanilla. Okay, so a banana, a good banana.

[00:48:54] Are we up to a dollar 25 for like organic bananas? Are we going for that though? She's got wonderbread a slice of bread. I don't know, man. Yeah, I don't know either. Fives high. Absolutely insane. what's one thing [00:49:07] that you're working on to improve your romantic relationships?

[00:49:09] And I said that that made it sound like there are many and I've met Yeah. Variety

[00:49:16] I can got. Got it. Mm-hmm. What's one thing in your self-love practice? I'm reading, I have a workbook called the Self-Compassion Workbook, and I've slowly been going through it. That's so cool. And it's really interesting cuz this workbook talks about how self-compassion is different from self-esteem because self-esteem is rooted in I am smart, I am good at this.

[00:49:40] I'm as opposed to radical self-compassion, which is no matter what I love myself. Wow. It's giving yourself the unconditional love that a parent should have for their child. Oh, interesting. I always thought self-esteem was based on the promises you keep with yourself. this says like, self-esteem is, is almost, um, about qualities in yourself.

[00:50:00] Whereas self-compassion is, is is about I love myself no matter what. Oh, boy. Yeah. Yeah. It's pretty hard. Yeah. I was like, [00:50:07] I don't know about Diox. Why didn't, why do you think I got a workbook? Yeah. Like, send me that Amazon link. Yeah. Or, or it's called Small Bookstore Link, I think the Self-Compassion workbook.

[00:50:16] That's cool. Okay. And then the, the final question that I ask everybody, what's the best love advice you've ever been given? Hmm.

[00:50:24] I feel like all the advice I got was shit.

[00:50:26] Alternatively, oh, since you have been in like a really great, healthy, happy marriage and relationship for 15 years, if there's something that you think would be like, A tip to give to somebody else. A, a person who makes you not only better, but more you. Mm. Like the best version of yourself in a way that feels yourself, if that makes sense.

[00:50:47] That makes so much sense. Go with the person where not only you, they're not trying to change you, they're not trying to change you. They just out the best in you in a way that makes you happy. That is goals. That's, that's kind of, and no one ever necessarily said that to me. Right, so I'm saying it to me now.

[00:51:03] You go home, you're like, gotta go [00:51:07] kidding. I'm in love with Rory. Oh, I've been waiting. The the great we can end now. That's all I wanted. If people wanna find more of you, where can they find you? I would suggest, like, I know I keep. Mentioning it, and it sounds really weird, but I just read it. I loved your book.

[00:51:23] I I love that you love the book. Thank you so much. I released it in the thick of the pandemic. It's great. It was released in a vacuum. I'm so glad you read it. I, I, that means so much to me. So read the book. You can go to my Instagram. Rachel does stuff. Amazing. Guys. Get the, get the book. Okay. Thank you so much for Thank you for having me.

[00:51:39] Yeah, this was a blast. I truly landed and like immediately texted Sarah and was like, I'm in love with Rachel. She's like, yeah, duh.