Dating with Herpes feat. Sophie Miller

[03:58:00]

Thank you. Happy to be here. Thank you.

I'm happy to have you. I think, you give me hope for the future. I think that what you're doing to, like, destigmatize something that has been so stigmatized in our world, which is so hypersexual, is really fucking cool. and I would love learn a little bit more about your journey. So, for those that don't know, I guess we'll just jump right in.

You have HSV 1.

I do generally. Yeah.

Yes, and there was a time very recently where you didn't.

Yeah, no. Yep. Yeah. It happened just about a month ago.

So what was dating like prior to having an STI?

So, I've been single for five years. Love being single. Um, and... I've just been pretty sexually active and I don't see anything wrong with that.

It doesn't make me better or lesser to the woman standing next to me or better or lesser of a woman myself.

A hundred

percent.

yeah, as long as you're not like seeking [03:59:00] validation through hookups, all good, all good, you know? yeah, just kind of hooking up, but then also just long term situationships. Like, I'm not as much into, One night stands as I was in college.

So mostly recently just been like long term situationships, not leading into a relationship. And then I had one that recently ended. So I was like, okay, I'll just hit up this one guy that I hooked up with in the past. We knew each other all through high school. So we were like pretty good friends. And then, um, that night I started like, yeah, it just happened like that.

So, question, when did you start dating?

Dating.

Like, how long have you been sexually active or like, dating around?

I started, I was young. I was always very sexually curious per se. So I lost my virginity when I was 14. And then I've had like boyfriends through high school. Like, [04:00:00] I had three boyfriends. And I haven't had a boyfriend since my junior year of high school,

I'm now um, 21. So. college was all pretty much one night stands, and I never had an STD until herpes, though.

So, in the seven years that you've been having sex, have you ever been with a partner that's told you about whether or not their diagnosis?

No,

So you've gone seven years, and no one's ever told you that they have herpes.

No, I never, I didn't know anything about it, like, until I got it. I thought that it was something that you're always going to visibly have, like, for the rest of your life, you're just going to have sores all the time, everywhere. I, I, like, knew nothing about it, so. When I'm like Googling, I have this on my body.

You know, when you have like a stomach ache and then you go on Google and it's like, what do I have? And it tells you that you're dying, but obviously like, you know, you're not. Yeah, exactly. I was thinking that with herpes, I'm like. [04:01:00] Googling it's like, oh you probably have herpes and I was like, okay Like that's like over exaggeration.

I don't have it. Like probably just some ingrown hairs. Google's just doing that to me again No, I had herpes Like that was like the one time it was just actually preparing me for what was gonna happen

Yeah, that was the one time it was right. So do you know what the stat is on like how, like one in, is it one in three?

 I found so many different ones because it's like There's probably so many people that have it and just aren't even Tested for it or don't know that they have it because it lays dormant. So it's like so many different stats I but I do know that 67 percent globally people have it which is more than like more than half of the world

Yeah. So it is pretty wild that you went seven years and no one ever told you.

Nothing nothing no one ever told me like I know my best friends who've had STDs before like chlamydia and stuff, but I personally never got it. and I didn't know of a [04:02:00] any of my partners that had anything.

Yeah, that's crazy. Okay. So then your situationship ends and this is like a guy friend that had been like kind of circling or in the ether.

Yeah. Like we, we hooked up before and we, we've known each other throughout high school. We were, we were always like we're friends. Yeah. It was just homies.

Yeah. And why don't you tell me a little bit about that night, whatever you feel comfortable sharing

right. Yeah. So things ended like the day before. With me and this other guy and then that guy texted me that night and He was like, hey, you want to come over as it's been a while and he's been hitting me up for a while now And I was like, no, no, no, and finally I was like, okay, fine.

I'm like, all right. Um, so yeah, I went over and We watched like that new Winnie the Pooh peacock. It was, don't watch it. It's terrible. Don't do it It's really bad. And so, yeah, then

How, how, how long did you make it through that movie?

like, 20 minutes? Not even.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know. I love, I love the idea of like, hey, the real Netflix and chill. It's [04:03:00]like, hey, let's pretend to watch a movie for approximately 15 to 20 minutes before we hook up.

yes, exactly. Yeah, so we had, like, some wine. we played heads up. We were like, no,

Oh, that's fun.

very sexy, getting in the mood, yeah. And then, um, I don't know exactly what happened, but at some point things just started going. And then, um, Ended and I took off. I was like, okay. Yeah, that's like my go to.

I don't like sleepovers I don't love cuddling sometimes I just want sex death you up. Good night. And Yeah, so I went on my way and then I'm on my way home and I'm like Something doesn't feel too good.

Oh, it was immediate.

It was immediate. Yeah. No. Yeah, it was immediate And then I went home, and I peed and I was like, Ooh, that doesn't feel great.

So I've been the next day I went to urgent care because I thought I had a UTI, like it was hurting just so bad. and then it hurt, like I got the meds for UTI, and [04:04:00] um, they didn't work, like, so I was thinking, Oh, this is probably something way worse, so, it's two days into the meds on, like the UTI meds, they're not working, so, I wasn't thinking of anything else at this point, uh, that it could be anything else, I'm making an appointment at my gyno, because the UTI meds aren't working, so, I'm uncomfortable, urgent care probably. Give me the right thing or that it's something worse going on. So, yeah, I made the appointment at my doctor. and then like the day after is when I started having sores. So I was like, okay, well, good thing I have my doctor's appointment because probably need to get this checked out too. And, yeah, I went in and I'm like telling my doctor all my symptoms, which has just been like, I have my right lymph node was swollen and it hurt to pee and, just feeling like really gross under the weather and.

I said, like, now I have, like, sores and they hurt, and she was like, yeah, no, that sounds like herpes, and in my, I was, like, still in disbelief at this point, I was like, you didn't even look, [04:05:00] you don't know what you're talking about, like, she's just, like, it's just the, like, scare factor, like, okay, and then, um, yeah, she, like, Took a look because it was also my first annual pap smear.

Never had that before. you

get to

go.

wow, welcome.

Yeah, once you turn 21, you get welcomed to the pap smear club. So, got that. And then, yeah, she swabbed the sores and was like, I can tell you right now it's herpes. And I was like, okay, and then she's like talking me through everything and I was just like so in shock that I didn't ask any of the questions that I needed to, I still didn't know how it worked, I remember thinking, because I had to go to work after, and I remember, yeah, no, it was a crazy, crazy day, I remember like at work just writing in my notes all the questions that I needed to ask, like, if I have it genitally, does that mean that, because it's HSV 1, does that mean if I have present sores, can I still not kiss somebody?

Like, I knew nothing. So I was like,

Well, wait, [04:06:00] how did you find out, did she know just by looking at it that it was HSV 1?

No, no, so, It came back in the culture when they swabbed it. Just because you have, like, the sores genitally, that doesn't make it HSV 2. Or just because you have sores, like, cold sores, orally, that doesn't, mean that it's HSV 1.

It's just more common in those places.

Yes.

did you notice that guy had a cold sore when you hooked up?

No, I think, I think that he, cause he could've given it to me, like, sexually too. cause it's like, just because you have it on your genitals, and you, like, spread it to me, I'm, I'm not automatically going to have HSV 2, but if I were to transmit it to somebody, it would still be HSV

Right, right, right. But you didn't see anything, is I guess what I'm getting at.

yeah, no, I talked to my doctor about that, I said, if I saw anything, obviously I wouldn't have engaged, and she was like, well, here's the thing about guys, and I was like, here we [04:07:00] go, and apparently guys can get like one or two sores, and then they go away on their own, Like, because, like, the swords themselves just go away, and then they think nothing of it.

Oh. Okay.

Yeah,

it's more common that like, yeah, they just don't even, they don't follow up. They won't go get it tested. They won't go get it looked at. They're like, Oh, that was a weird thing that happened.

yeah, they'll be like, oh, maybe I just had, like, ingrown hairs, yeah.

Okay. Okay. So you go to the gyno, she tells you right then and there you have herpes and you just go into shock. Like what is your mind doing at that time?

Yeah, oh, I remember just, like, the, what I thought was the worst happened at that time, and I'm just, I didn't cry until she left the room. I just didn't know what to think. I had so... Many things going through my mind like who's gonna ever wanna be with me? I'm gonna have to tell every single person that I am dating that I have her peace now.

And I remember like, how am I gonna [04:08:00] have kids? Just so many things going through my mind. I was just devastated, like felt like I was tainted. And at the same time, like grieving. life style that I used to have before

yeah.

It's weird. It's like, think it's so hyperbolic, but it feels like a death sentence. Like, and I guess it is, it's the death of that life that you were leading. But it is so wild, because it is not a death sentence.

No,

that we've built STIs up in our country, and just our culture to be this thing that is so awful and evil, that it just really, like, I can imagine how awful and terrified you probably were.

Yeah, and it's still like one of those moments where it's hard to pinpoint exactly what I was feeling because it was like a, a little bit traumatic that I blacked out, I don't really remember a lot of what I was, I just blanked, my mind was going everywhere.

The only thing I remember [04:09:00] is when I got back in my car after she told me that I had herpes, and. There were so many people in the cars next to me that it was like I'm bawling and eventually I just had to like Drive my car into some like random place so I could actually talk but I was just a mess like a mess

I'm sorry you went through that. But I'm glad that you're feeling better now.

Yeah, yeah, very much. Yeah

Did anybody know that you were going through this? Like, did you tell anybody, Hey, I think I have this thing going on, like, before you went to the doctor?

Yeah, so one of my best friends she's a nurse Well, she's in nursing school. Yeah. Yeah, so I'm sending her all these pictures And we're just on like deep Google for days, and she's like trying to be like, I don't think it's herpes. Like, I think it's, I'm like, no, it is, it is, I'm just going to make my peace with it now.

And she's like, no, it could be any of these things. I'm like, no, it's herpes. I'm like sending her pictures of like what it looks like. I couldn't do that to anybody else. Like, it was not a pretty sight to see. So [04:10:00] that's like what, like a best, like best friend thing kind of do.

Did, um, the guy that you hook up with ever, text you or hit you up?

He didn't know he had it. So I told him and I called him and I said hey This is not a fun conversation for you or me uh I have herpes, and I wasn't gonna be like, you gave me herpes, like, you can come to that conclusion yourself, but I have herpes, and I also, like, I wasn't mad at him, because the way that he's gonna feel now, knowing that he has herpes, is the way that I felt 24 hours before, so I'm not gonna make it any worse for him, and be mad at him when he didn't even know, it's like, I was, Just like just go to go get tested.

he just felt so bad. He felt so bad He said I'm so sorry. I mean, I can't believe it's like I'm so so sorry like, please don't hate me, whatever, instead of, I don't, just like, go get tested. Yeah, he got tested. He was positive, but he didn't know, and you don't really think to go get tested for [04:11:00] specifically herpes.

Like, when you go get tested for STDs, you think you're getting tested for everything. You're not,

 Yeah, they specifically don't test people for herpes because the psychological damage it does is so extreme that they leave it off of your routine STI panel. And that should tell you everything you need to know about how we have stigmatized specifically that virus in our country.

Yeah,

Like, you hear it's not curable, and you're, like, everything else, chlamydia, gonorrhea, syphilis, you can cure it, it's just because it's not curable that, that's, it's, it's scary to hear.

but neither's mono.

and and by the way, you know that's the same family.

I didn't. I did

Yeah, Mono, Epstein Barr, all in the Herpes family. so it's, it's just, it's interesting how Mono is this type of thing that goes around also in college, and no one seems to vilify it in the same way, [04:12:00] but it is part of the same family.

Man, yeah, I didn't, I did not even know that.

I know a lot of very weird facts about illnesses.

Um, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It makes you think.

Okay, so you're at work and you're like compiling this list of all of these questions. I mean, hats off to you that you were able to work that day. That's, that's impressive.

yeah, it was it was a lot.

did they give you anything for pain?

So they were going to give me Lidocaine, but my. Insurance didn't cover it. So I went without that.

Wait, what?

Yeah, um, so I ended up getting just the, uh, Veltrax. I got that, but then I went to work, I work in a medical facility where we have, Lidocaine, like BLT cream.

So I just stole some, went to the bathroom and was like, it was more potent than the light at 5 percent lidocaine that I would have gotten. So that helped anyway.

That is insane

that you [04:13:00] weren't able to get pain management because it wasn't covered by your insurance.

yeah, no, it was, it was really bad. It was bad for like a week,

Really? Okay. Man, just the sores or just everything that you had before?

just the sores. So the timeline is like, Monday is when I started seeing the sores. Um, and I made the appointment at my gyno. I went in on Wednesday, and then I had herpes. And then, I work Thursday, I always have Fridays off, and Friday is when I started sleeping the whole weekend.

Like, I slept 11 hours Friday, 11 hours Saturday, and 13 hours on Sunday. I have it all, like, you know, your Apple Watch tracks how much you sleep. It was crazy.

Right, because you felt kind of like, fluish, yeah?

I was, yeah, I mean, not at that point either, I was just so tired. Like, you know when you first wake up in the morning and your eyes are like half open and you're like trying to text one of your friends and you're misspelling [04:14:00] things and you have to delete and then go back and you're just so tired?

 I would just keep sleeping. I would wake up. It's like, I just never felt well rested. I'm just constantly tired and bad.

Got it, got it. Okay. And, um, let's call your friend Bobby. Is that cool? just want to make sure that's not his actual name. Could you imagine?

I'm like, let's call him Mike. You're like, let's not call him Mike.

yeah, Bobby. So you tell Bobby and. I'm impressed. It sounds like such an evolved conversation.

Like, the fact that you didn't take it out on him speaks volumes about your character. The fact that he responded in kind speaks volumes about his character. He goes, gets tested. He finds out, of course, he also has herpes. Do you guys lean on each other? Do you talk about it? Do you, or is it more of a, mm, we haven't really talked since?

Yeah, we haven't talked since I should I should be like How are you? Like, but yeah, we just haven't talked I mean, [04:15:00] cause I called him and then he said, well, I have to work. I don't know when I'm going to be able to get tested. And then it took him like five days to get tested and then another three days and yeah.

And

waited.

yeah, I'll find the text of like what you said, cause he felt so. Bad. I felt bad that he felt bad. Um, he just said, like, I feel I feel so bad. I've been sick to my stomach ever since you told me. And he said, um. I appreciate you telling me it means a lot. I know it just bothers me because the last time I had sex was almost two months ago. Like I'm not very active, so it baffles me that it's gotten to me and you, which I know you haven't been active much either. So I just wish I knew before I said, you don't have to be super active to get it.

So many people have it, but, yeah, you probably, cause he was thinking that he never had like a outbreak. He said that he thought that they were ingrown hairs, so it makes me think, like, maybe he did, but you just didn't go and get checked out, but nothing we can do about it now.

Right, right, right. It's, there's no point in, getting mad about the past because it won't change the [04:16:00] future.

Exactly.

So we don't know what Bobby's up to. Okay. Interesting.

I haven't talked about this yet. The guy that I had the situationship with, I thought that he could've Giving it to me. I didn't, there was a time when I first had herpes, when I didn't know who gave it to me.

well, yeah, I mean, it's not like it comes with a invitation letter.

No, yeah, I didn't, I was, cause it, there was Bobby, and then we'll say that there was, um, Freddie, okay? So Freddie was the situationship guy, and , he could've given it to me, he could've given it to me orally, because I was thinking, oh, I have HSV 1, maybe he has it orally, because, Bobby didn't go down on me, Freddie did,

I understand why Freddy was more long term then.

yes.

So, exactly.

So, I... I feel so bad for this still, I was like, Hey, like, maybe you should get tested and I put him like through so much mental, agony waiting for these test results to come back and he didn't have it, [04:17:00] which was good. but at the same time, we were really only talking for a few days.

Just about the herpes tests, and then all of a sudden he didn't have, I was like, really relieved about that. So happy for you. Have a good one. And yeah, we haven't talked since, but we weren't talking since the situationship ended anyway, and so then it was like, okay, but I still felt like it was Bobby from the beginning just because of how my body reacted right after.

Yeah.

Yeah, that is... I mean, it was fast.

It was, yeah. quick.

I have a question for you, and I don't want this to sound judgmental. I'm genuinely curious. So, it sounds like to me, you don't use condoms.

I didn't. No, I was very, it was kind of like, I've gone. Pregnancy wasn't an option for me.

Yes, it wasn't a fear because I never, I've had the same birth control for so long. I've never had any issues. So I knew that it worked very [04:18:00] well. And at the same time, I've gone so long without getting an S, seven years without getting an STD.

So I was like, I think I'm a pretty good pick and chooser. And I don't know why, like my parents always very much instilled condoms with like, for me to use my mom, especially because HIV was very. Much a thing and growing up where she was and all the friends that she had and it was very scary then and still is now don't get me wrong, but yeah condoms just I Wish I were more more strict about my usage of them and going forward Obviously because it's like it doesn't make a difference whether like feeling wise whether you use them or not

Not really, no.

no it really doesn't so just do it

Yeah, I'm, again, it's not a judgment, it's a... I also was like that for... When I was your age, which makes me, holy fuck, saying that sentence makes me want to shoot myself in the face. LAUGHS

stop

When I was your [04:19:00] age. No But truly like when I was your age, like I didn't either. and now it's so routine for me which is I think honestly a habit from I, I just went through this phase where like every guy I would have sex with would insist on using a condom and then it became habit for me and then now it's like, yeah, I, I definitely want to use a condom.

And so they're a huge part of my sex life, but I, You know, I haven't been 21 in a minute. And so I'm just so curious about like the culture around that, in college, out of college, like, is that a conversation? Do most people bring it up? Or is it more like, Hey, when was the last time you had sex? Are you clean?

Yeah, I'm clean. Or, you know,

so yeah,

cause I feel like when I was younger, it was more just like, This was in the last time I had sex, like, nothing's been weird, and he'd be like, same, and I'd be like, okay, cool, so then we can like, fuck without a condom.

yeah, it was, it's just like, Okay. Nobody had them on that. I just, nobody had them. I, I don't know how to explain it. It just felt, the less, [04:20:00] I had sex with a condom recently. And I remember him pulling it out and my reaction was like, wow, good for you. Cause it's been so long that like people don't, around my age, don't use them.

personally, I've never bought a condom before. I've never gone to the store to buy condoms. Like, either the guys have it, or they don't, but recently, yeah, this one guy pulled it out, I was like, go you! Cause it's just, really, people don't, they assume everything's fine, everything's good.

there are a lot of very cool, options now that deliver. So you never have to go buy them.

huh,

Yeah,

I had this company GEMS, J E M S, on. They're dope. I mean, there's a lot of, like, really amazing I also, like, use this brand Lola. Both of them are,

yeah, yeah, like, natural condom companies.

They deliver. They're discreet. so gems is like only silicone because some people have allergies to latex. Anyway, there are lots of options. I'm not trying to sell you on condoms, [04:21:00] but I personally think it is cool. Like I actually think it's cool that there are companies doing that because I just want it to feel like more accessible and more normal.

You know? I think if you can take the stress and anxiety off of. getting an STI. or pregnancy It just makes sex more enjoyable

Yeah, and like the conversations before, like, I would have conversations all the time about what do you like in bed? What don't you like?

And now I, and now I can incorporate like, when was the last time you've been tested? And like, all of that because I'm so open about having conversations.

Sexual conversations with men and like talking to my girls about it and everything, but it's like I was never talked about actual sexual health.

Yeah, isn't that wild?

Yeah,

I'm so wow. So you before you have sex with Partners, you'll be like, what are you into

yeah, because it's like I want to make it enjoyable for the both of [04:22:00] us, even though this is something that I would do. It's so funny. I would take when I would go to a guy's house, I would take my vibrators with me. I feel like he's not going to get the job done. So I would,

uh,

shit okay, I have this one vibrator that is It's like this small. It looks like, it's like, fit like the palm of your hand. I swear by it and the perfect thing is it fits in every purse. So anytime I go on a date, I put it in there and I'll just whip it out. And then guys are always like, whoa, they find it hot.

I mean, if, if a guy didn't find it hot, it would be like such a massive red flag that I

would be

hate, yeah, I hate when guys get threatened by toys in the bedroom. Like, why do you need that? Why do you need that? I can do that.

Okay, sure. Then you start vibrating my dude. Let me

Exactly. Yeah, come on. Faster.

And I'm like, I'm like, sorry, your fingers are not moving that fast.

No, uh, But yeah, I've very been like very sexually vocal and empowered, but just not in [04:23:00]the way that's probably the most important. And now, you know, I am, but it's still hard to still gotta figure out who I'm gonna talk about. It's still nerve wracking

in a way.

Um,

I'm sure. Yes.

the reason why I made a point to ask you about how long you'd been having sex and how many people had ever told you that they had an STI was to show what you're now up against

that.

Oh, shit, yeah.

If 67 percent of people have herpes, right. you have more than a 50 percent chance of, hooking up with somebody who does have it.

And yet no one's going to tell you, but you're the outlier. You're walking around having these open, honest, frank conversations with people and you're doing that with the burden. You're doing that with the burden of feeling like you have this scarlet letter or whatever those feelings you felt in that doctor's office.

Now I'm sure you've worked through those feelings, but it, that is a stigma that our society has like put on, on people. [04:24:00] And so it's very brave because you could easily not have said a word.

You could not be on this podcast, you could be walking around, having sex with anyone and everyone, no condom, and pretending like you don't have it.

yeah, no, but that's not a, no, I don't want that option. I've been having people reach out being like, you know, you don't have to disclose if you're not having an outbreak. And it's like, but you do, like I still got it from somebody who didn't have an active outbreak.

not, uh, yes, I'm not advocating that you do that, but I'm just saying that there are multiple routes that you could have taken, and you have chosen the one that I think is the most ethical, but it's also brave. It takes a lot of courage. To go on a date with someone that you don't know very well, you know, first dates are first dates.

And then if you want to have sex with somebody after a first date, you're now having a pretty intimate and personal conversation with them.

yeah, yeah, no, we weren't. So the first date went well, we had a lot in common. And then it was like a few [04:25:00] days later, I went over to his place, we were watching some documentary, and like, things were starting to get heavy, but not too heavy, my clothes were still on, his clothes were still on, and then, I was like, okay, I have to tell you something, and so I told him, and he was just very, didn't have much to say afterwards, like didn't, didn't want to touch me with a 10 foot pole, like very taken aback.

And then all of a sudden it was like, well, I have to wake up super early in the morning. So I was like, for sure. And um, yeah, so then I left and I didn't, I didn't do anything wrong. Maybe I, I probably threw a bunch of information at him really quick. Like that was the first time I ever disclosed to somebody.

So maybe I didn't go about it the best way possible. I don't really know. but

the fact that you did it is the best way possible. Like at the end of the day, you had the conversation.

Yeah. Yeah. And, um, then he texted me recently and it was pretty [04:26:00] much just like, thanks for telling me. I don't think, anything less of you, but I don't see things moving forward right now. And I was like, no prob. Like, okay. But

Wow, I'm sorry. I bet that was disappointing.

yeah, I mean, kind of. He wasn't working with much anyway, so it kind of like didn't bother me that much. But like, I feel like, you know, it was just like, okay. It would suck a lot more if it was somebody that I had a lot more feelings for, was very, very attracted to, and then got like that.

But I feel like the first time disclosing was with the right guy, and it wasn't like such like a joke. Downer like heartbreaker. So I feel like that actually went pretty well for the way that it turned out

Yeah, totally. Okay, so how long between Finding out that you had herpes, it healing, then when was the next time you, went out on a date?

It was a quick turnaround. Like a month, everything. Within a month I went on a date and told this guy.

How did your friends [04:27:00] react?

So I only had one person. It was when it was first blowing up the video and he called me and was like, Hey, you should probably take this down. And I was like, no. And he was like, I'm going to tell you this as a friend, like you should take their video down. I said, no, like if you read the comments, I'm like actually helping people and doing something good.

And he was like, all right, buddy, like good luck with that. And then hung up. And so I blocked him on everything. Uh, my other friends have been very, very nice. just super cool. I haven't had an issue with them, but then, later that night, I went out for one of my friend's birthdays and I saw him out and all of his friends too and they're like, yeah, I just, I don't get why you would do that.

I don't understand why you post that. And then I had one of the, one guy come up to me and be like, man, if you didn't have herpes, I'd fuck the shit out of you. And then he continued to like, hit my vape. I just thought that that was like, kind of funny. That I could have had like, oral herpes and whatever.

Like, dude, you're so stupid. I wouldn't have [04:28:00] had sex with him anyway. So, it's like, okay,

thanks. I mean, like, seriously, like, what's your, herpes or not, you still couldn't have gotten it, whatever.

So it was mostly guys. Guys gave you the pushback. In

being vocal

all guys. Every guy. I have not had one girl that I've been friends with come for me, have like, I've had only girls that I haven't even talked to in years reach out to me. Be like, hey, I saw your video and I just want to say like, I'm so proud of you. All guys are the ones that have an issue with it.

Okay, we need, we need to investigate that. Cause obviously there's something you're doing that is very threatening.

in my comments with the first video, the first video that has over like 10 million views, all the comments are women. Every, it's like 99 percent women. And then, I will have maybe one or two guys DM me every day, one or two, but they won't comment, [04:29:00] and they'll reach out to me, be like, thank you, I have herpes, or men don't really talk about it.

Wow,

that's, well that's, okay. So that's interesting because I've had two men tell me that they have herpes.

really? Yeah. Nope.

but, the difference is one, I'm older than you. I think that's probably a factor. And two, I now have this podcast. So I talk very openly about a lot of things and not a lot throws me. There's not a lot.

You're going to like to, to shake me. and. The second guy only told me because I had told him that I ended up, I was with a man for a long period of time who on our second date disclosed that he had herpes. And I was with him for a very long time and I never got it. And I know that because I get tested regularly, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

And then in that conversation. This man that I had been having sex with for several months. Now, we'd only ever used a condom, but still, that [04:30:00] doesn't

mean that... Yeah, he also disclosed that he has it. And I also know that I still don't have it because I got tested a month ago. and haven't had sex with either of them since.

But it is wild how... The first person, the first guy... Part of the reason why I trusted him so much is I knew that when he told me it meant That I could trust him that he would have uncomfortable conversations with me that he was prioritizing my health safety and security over his Potential embarrassment or potential rejection, you know the mental math that I did during that conversation I was like, oh this is a partner who Is gonna let me know if he

feels an outbreak coming on

because he has already told me before we've even had sex and He didn't have to

Right.

I feel like women are more receptive to that, too. again, haven't had that much experience telling men. But I [04:31:00] feel like, like, I mean, did you have a stigma around it before he told you, or were you pretty familiar with what herpes was at that time?

that's a great question. I do think I had a stigma around it for sure And I think it would be safe to say I still do that's That's because I've lived my whole life with it being projected at me, right? I don't, just because you know something doesn't mean that you can totally undo it. It's kind of like racial bias, right?

Like I want to say, like, I try and live my life a certain way, but I also know that there are probably things that affect my perspective that I'm unaware of. So it's like, I think you kind of constantly have to be checking yourself and doing the work. And I feel like that, I feel like the same way with me with kind of everything, right?

Not, not just like STIs, not just feminism, not just racism, not any of the isms.

Um, but being with him, I will say this. The first time he had an outbreak, I freaked out. not publicly.

But once we got over [04:32:00] that, it wasn't really an issue. He also, went on Valtrex prophylactically and then, like, never had an outbreak. So, he started taking it every day and then literally just never had another outbreak.

Okay. Yeah, I started taking it every day. I missed a day, I think, a few days this week, actually.

which which brings us, which brings us to now.

I'm having my second outbreak!

How did you, how did you know? Like how did you know that it was coming or what's the, what, how do you feel different?

I didn't know, I just slept again. I slept all day yesterday. But ever since having my first outbreak, I've been very... I've been much more aware of my downstairs area. And, check it out a little bit more. You know, make sure everything's good. And, so I've been sleeping a lot, again. And then, this morning I woke up, and I was like, And it seemed just like two little [04:33:00] bums, but maybe I'm just freaking myself out. Maybe it is an ingrown hair. I don't even know. But yeah, I mean, it would make sense if it was an outbreak just because of how much I've been sleeping again.

All right. Well, I think you're in a very specific window where you're pro, like you're learning your body and you're learning about this,

Yeah. Yeah.

you know? So.

It's kind of to be expected.

I do have, three dates coming up. In a row, I mean, like, Tuesday, Wednesday.

it girl.

Yeah, I'm not letting the, I'm not letting rejection stop me.

Nor should you. I mean, you're also so public about this.

Yeah, I didn't want to be, but it just so happened that there was no turning back. So, now, it's like I'm glad that I am. Because I have very thick skin, too. I don't really let anything get to me, especially because it's like, men, and don't get me wrong, I don't think that, I don't think of men as lesser than at all,

You'll get there. No, I'm kidding.

I mean, you know, right?

You know what I have learned? Is God [04:34:00] gives the biggest dicks to the dumbest motherfuckers. It is so, and it's so upsetting.

Okay. Hold on. I need to calculate. I'm trying, I'm thinking of all the dicks I've been with.

I think, when I say biggest, I think girth. Like,

Oh, oh, okay. Girth wise. Well,

because I feel like girth does it more than length ever will. Like, that personal opinion,

I mean, you know, the guys can have the preference like ass or titties. Like, girth or length. I'm going girth.

yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

I, I, would go curved.

Like a hooked.

I can go,

time. Um,

heck yeah. I can get behind that.

yeah, it's just, the comments really don't bother me. I know the facts about it. I know that like I'm a catch but at the same time, it's understandable because it's hard because if you asked me two months ago, if I would date somebody with herpes, I would have said no.

So it's [04:35:00] like, I get where you're coming from, but like, hear me out, you know, like, hear me out.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I get that. I mean, I think that you are oddly wise for being 21.

Oh, oh, thank you.

Yeah. so what do you wish that people knew about Herpes, they don't seem to know.

Just because you have sex with somebody that has it doesn't mean you're going to get it. especially, like I talked about this too, if we are aware of our status, we're gonna take those extra precautions. you don't get it. Like, I feel like you're more likely to get it from somebody who doesn't know that they have it, than somebody who does. that's just, that's how I feel.

Yeah,

I would agree with you on that, yeah. Because the person that knows is I mean, hopefully going to act accordingly and the person that

doesn't, it just has no idea.

Mmhmm. Exactly.

have you talked to your parents about this? Do they know about your TikTok? Why

okay. So the first person I called was my [04:36:00] dad and My dad and I we've always been very we've always had great a pretty good relationship Very good open communication. So I called my dad and I was like, I have herpes and I'm just like sobbing and he's like down. I know his heart was in the right place, but he invalidated my feelings.

He was like, you're crying over nothing. It's not a big deal. I was like, nobody's gonna want to be with me. Like, nobody's gonna love me. He was like, you know, my best friend has herpes, right? I was like, no. He was like, yeah, and he's been married twice. He's been married and divorced and remarried like fine.

It's like, you know that grandma gets cold sores on her lips I was like, no, it's like a grandma has herpes not the same kind but it's not that big of a deal And then I told my mom I was really scared to tell her.

were you really scared to tell her?

it's always been different. Like We've never really had conversations about sex or anything.

That's just not our thing.

Dynamic, yeah.

yeah. So, especially cause I remember I was like, I'm going to the guy now. I think I have a [04:37:00]UTI. She was like, have you been wearing condoms? And I was like, yeah. And I looked her dead in the eye and said, yes. Then I had to, you know, kind of tell her I lied. but, uh, yeah, so I was like, Mom, I had, my first pap smear.

And oh, by the way, I have herpes. And she was like, I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. and then at that point I kind of made peace with it too. And was like, no, it's like really okay. It's fine. She said, just don't tell anybody like that's nobody's business. don't tell your friends. I wouldn't even tell like, especially don't tell your sister.

Like, don't tell anybody. I was like, okay. Knowing I posted that TikTok at the time, but it wasn't, it didn't quite go anywhere yet. and then a week later when the video was at like 7 million views and then I just didn't interview with NBC. So I was like, Oh, I think I have to tell her now. So I go downstairs and I said, I was like, mom, I did something and I'm really proud of it, but I did a really good thing. And she was like, what did you do? I was like, don't be mad at me. every time you hear that from a kid, you're like, Oh God. And so I said, um, so I. Posted a TikTok about me having herpes. She said, [04:38:00] Sophie! You know. She was more worried for me and she's come around a lot. And she's very proud of me now, but at first it was just so, so scary telling them. I thought they would

Well, I think I mean, look, I'm not your mom and I don't know what her, what the drive was behind what you said, but to me, my instinctual reaction was, yeah, she was just trying to protect you.

Exactly, yeah, yeah.

You know, And you're disrupting, you're disrupting the norm, which we need. But, I don't think any mother wants to see their child the face of something that could potentially hurt their feelings.

right, yeah. That's exactly what she was, where she was. Like, and she's still kind of scared about my dating life and everything with that. But she just told me, you know, it's just gonna be a good dating filter now. And I said, yeah, it will be, which is good because I, like, even before I got herpes, I was I was ready to settle down with somebody, but I [04:39:00] kept staying with the people that didn't want a relationship and I would be like, yeah, no, me neither.

Same. No, yeah, I did. and then I would pretty much be their girlfriend without the title and they would still be going on dates. I would still be going on dates, but we had such like a strong connection that we were like each other. Number one, and I'll be cleaning their apartment. And it was just that happened for like a year where I would just since 2020, I've been in these situations like this without.

Having an actual relationship, so it's like now I'm, I think that I like have to, which I'm like happy for, but I also feel like it might be a little harder now.

You know, this is like the big sister in me, but it's like, I think there's a very cliche phrase where it's like, we accept the love we think we deserve.

Yeah,

It sounds to me like you know what you want, but you were compromising your own boundaries to get something that looked similar to it, but wasn't actually it.

And the longer you do that, the more you do chip away [04:40:00] at your own self respect, right? And now you're not doing that, you know? Like, I think that it's great and empowering and you're, you've done like a full 180. And it also sounds like you have a lot more self love now. Now that might just be, that might not be accurate, I don't know, but it sounds like this has forced you to really, fortify yourself in a way where moving forward you seem very strong and very brave and capable and like you're going to set terms that you're not willing to cross anymore.

yeah, oh yeah, I mean this has been the longest, and keep in mind it's been like a month, this is the longest I've been without sex in a very long time, just because I've had, someone that I was consistent with, even though it wasn't a relationship, but I would always have one person that I would just be consistent with, even though it wasn't a relationship, but it's like, I I'm such a giver, and I would just, I'd have such like a big heart that I would still like, treat them as if they were my boyfriend, and then I would [04:41:00] get like, you know, The bare minimum and it's been like that for so long and it's just I liked having a person is what I like realized having just a person that I'm comfortable with even if it's like not a relationship, but now it's it's been five years and I, I'm ready.

I want a boyfriend as much as I've been saying, like, I don't want a boyfriend. I don't want a boyfriend, but that's what I was like doing my, my thing, but it's like, I want a boyfriend now,

Yeah, I mean, I'm gonna give you unsolicited advice and it's that I very relate to that position. I was like that a lot. I give a lot when I'm in relationships, but it came at the expense of my own self, you know, like you have hopes and dreams and goals and things that you want. And in those times where you feel like, God, I just want to be loved, or I just want to have a person, I just want to remind you, you know, That you do.

You are your own person. You are your own number one and take all of that energy that you would give to somebody else and start giving it to [04:42:00] yourself because I think that you have a lot to give to the world and I don't know what your, like, aspirations are for career, travel, family, all of these things outside of dating.

But instead of giving that energy to your love life, you can give it to something else and create a life that is even bigger than the one that you have right now.

 Yeah, it's, yeah, it's still a lot, I haven't gone out since the weekend I found out that I had herpes. Besides my every Sunday karaoke that I do with my 70 year old friends. That's neither here nor there, but...

Like 7

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

one of them is Santa. Grows his beard out, yeah. He's Santa, like, deadass Santa.

Well, we're gonna have to... Let's, let's make an agreement. Let's do this again in a year.

Oh, shoot, okay.

You want to come back, you want to come back next November and let's, let's see where you're at in a year because I'm going to bet right now, that you are even more [04:43:00] successful, happier, healthier, and that you'll probably be in a relationship.

hopefully I won't be in this room anymore. I'm still living with my parents, so.

Okay, we're manifesting that. We're, we're putting it out into the ether. So I'm going to see you in a year and we're going to check in. But before I, I let you go, I want to know what's a killer move?

I'll just do, like, I'm out on a date with a guy. We get the bill. I always offer. And cross my fingers that they say no, but like always offer to pay because I don't know if a lot of women do that and then I still don't end up paying but like still i'm like I got it like no and they're like no your money's no good here.

I'm like Are you sure? Are you sure? Do you want to split it? Like,

And they're like, no.

But you're like, good answer, good

answer.

but I always offer.

What is a killer date?

Something that, you can both show your personalities in. I'm all for dinner and drinks, that's fine, but I really like activities. Something where you can do an activity and still get to know each other. I like stuff like that a lot.

[04:44:00] And what kills a date? A date killer. Who's

When they show you their whole camera roll,

like

doing

they're just so many, so many people when they're just like, Oh yeah, no, I did that like a few weeks ago. Look at that. Or like, yeah, no, when I was in college, I was in a frat and like, this is me in a frat. This is what I had to do when I was in a frat.

I'm like, Oh my God, that's so funny. And then I had to like call my sister and be like, um,

 Oh my God, that is wild. Okay. What is one thing in your self love practice?

 I like dance parties, like by myself, that's, I like moving my body, connecting with my energy. I love, that's what I love the most that I do, is my little dance parties.

That's awesome. That's the first time I've ever heard that. That's great. And last but not least, I ask everyone this, what is the best love or dating advice you've ever received?

never love someone from [04:45:00] your mood or needs or wants, always love someone from your heart.

What does that even mean?

if, just because you want something, like, just based on your moods, like, if you're hungry, or you're gonna give them more attention versus when you are full, like, you're not, like, don't love someone based on your moods, needs, or, or wants, just from your heart. Like, cause you're gonna be nicer to somebody if you want something from them, or if

get it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, that's great. Wow. Never heard that before. Cool. I love that. Sophie Miller,

like that one.

really dope. I so appreciate your time and everything that you're doing. if people want more of you, how do they find you?

probably through TikTok, or even my Instagram.

I will link to it. I'll link to

your TikTok and your Instagram below. So your links will be in the show notes. How about that?

Beautiful. Beautiful. Beautiful.

I love it. Thank you so, so, so, so much. This was great.

Thank you I, yes, no, I was going to say I will follow up on that. I really will.

Good. I hope you do.

[04:46:00] I will. But thank you so much for having me again.